General Fatigue: State of the U.S. Military

Host: Dr. Jamie Mitchell

Guest: Lt. Gen. Bob Dail

Note: This transcript is taken from a Stand in the Gap Today program aired on 1/27/26. To listen to the podcast, click HERE.

Disclaimer: While reasonable efforts have been made to provide an accurate transcription, the following is a representation of a mechanical transcription and as such, may not be a word for word transcript. Please listen to the audio version for any questions concerning the following dialogue.

Jamie Mitchell:

Another Tuesday edition of Stand in the Gap Today, I’m your host, Jamie Mitchell, Director of Church Culture for the American Pastors Network. Even though we find ourselves in an unusual time of peace around the globe and many of the boiling conflicts that seem to be resolving themselves, it would seem that we don’t need to give a lot of attention to our military. It used to be the largest budgetary item in our US spending plan, and yet many would conclude it’s because of this strength of the United States military is why we’re seeing peace break out around the world. Peace through strength. But even more so, many would say that there has been a major shift. In the military philosophy, once President Trump took office and became the commander-in-chief. This year, the Department of Defense was renamed the Department of War, and there seems to be a transformation taking place in the Pentagon.

The point of interest I’m reading about though is when you look at the United States military, it’s the upper ranks, the generals, the admirals, the joint chiefs, where there seems to be some churning happening. It’s a subject I want to understand, and I think it would be fascinating for you, our listeners. And so, to help us understand what it means to be a general, what better way to do that than to talk to one. General Bob Dail has served our nation. He served it for 33 years, retiring in 2008. At his retirement ceremony, he was a senior military logistic professional in the Department of Defense, now the Department of War. He was the 15th most senior ranking officer in the United States Army. And during his military career, he’s been honored to command and league organizations of the Army’s most storied and decorated units. And he’s been a commander, a brigade commander, and I could go through his whole resume, but here’s the most important part of his resume.

General Bob Dail loves the Lord Jesus and unashamedly lifts high the banner of Christ. And it’s such a joy to have Bob with us today. Bob, what an honor for you to be on Stand in the Gap Today. Welcome.

Bob Dail:

Well, good morning, Jamie. It’s great to be with you and your audience today, and I look very much forward to our conversation.

Jamie Mitchell:

Well, Bob, I know you by your first name, but because of this program, I’m going to refer to you most of the time as general. So I know it may sound a little strange, but I want to make sure I honor you today, especially in light of what you’re bringing to the table. So general, there’s much I want to talk to you about because I want to understand how the military works and especially the upper echelons of military function. But I want you to take a moment and give our listeners a quick glance about your background and then get us started and help us understand from your perspective, what’s the state of the United States military right now?

Bob Dail:

Well, I guess your guests have been able to read my bio, hopefully. But quickly, I’ll give you a summary of my background. I was born in Virginia and I was reared in Virginia in the Hampton Roads area down there in the Navy town, although I ended up in the army, but my father worked at the local naval base there was I was a young kid. And so that’s where I grew up. And I graduated from the University of Richmond. At the time was a big Baptist school, has since not affiliated itself with the Baptist Church. But when I went there, it was a Southern Baptist convention supported school. My parents didn’t have the money to send me away from home to college. So I joined the Army ROTC program to defray the cost of a college education. And upon graduation from the business school at the University of Richmond, I entered the army as a second lieutenant.

I never thought that I’d remain in the army for a career, to be very honest about it. When I went to college, I saw myself finishing up my military duty and maybe going back to law school or going into business or something. I never really had thought much about making the army a career. But when I was a lieutenant in my first assignments, I found that I liked the army. I liked army life. I liked the structure, the physical aspect of soldiering, being outdoors, working for great leaders, and primarily I just fell in love with the American soldier. So I served in the United States and Europe. I decided to stay. And in the 1970s and the early 1980s during the Cold War, I served in units that were involved in supporting ground combat operations and training in Europe, not combat operations, but training operations.

And when special operations became an area of interest in the military, in the early to mid ’80s, I volunteered to serve as a charter member of what became the 75th Ranger Regiment, the point of the spear for the United States Army. I later served in the 24th infantry division and served in combat with that division during Desert Shield and Desert Storm. And I think it’s interesting that we’re having this phone call today and having this conversation as we observed the 35th anniversary of Desert Shield and Desert Storm, a great military operation that was commanded by General Norman Schwartzkoff. I commanded a brigade in the 82nd Airborne Division, and later as a one star general, I commanded a support command in Europe during the Balkan Wars in Bosnia and Kosovo. I finished up my career as the Deputy Commander of United States Transportation Command at Scott Air Force Base in Illinois where we were responsible for moving and supporting America’s military around the globe.

And finally, my last assignment was as the 15th Director of the Defense Logistics Agency, which is the logistics provider for primarily all of the supplies that go around the world wherever soldiers are stationed and to support their readiness needs, except for ammunition. I had all of the responsibilities to support all of the troops except for the area of ammunition. On a personal level, I’ve been a believer since I accepted Jesus Christ when I was nine years old at the South Norfolk Baptist Church in Chesapeake, Virginia. I was reared in the Southern Baptist Church family, and I was active in my church and youth groups and all that you would expect as I was reared. And when I got to college at the University of Richmond, I met my wife, who was also a Baptist, and we’ve been married for 49 years. And my wife, she has been a Bible teacher for 43 years, and I’ve been the beneficiary of some of her teaching along the way.

You asked me about our military. I think you can see, really, in the last few months, the unmatched strength and professionalism of America’s military. In the past year, recruiting is up, it’s doing well, it’s come back, training is up. Our budgets have been provided by a great Congress that has ensured that the military is well funded. You look at the highly successful and complex military raid just in the last few weeks in Venezuela, very complex operation. You look at the Iranian bombing mission that we pulled together in late 2025 that took out the nuclear capability of Iran. Just a very complex operation involving multiple services. We’ve got the crazy-

Jamie Mitchell:

Hey Bob, when we come back, hold your thought. We’re going to get back more about today’s military. Stay with us. We’re hearing from a general today on Standing the Gap today. Well, welcome back. Today’s theme. I’ve entitled General Fatigue, the State of the US Military. Not that the military’s fatigued, but we want to understand about the life of a general and those who are in the upper echelons of our military and the heavyweight that they handle for us. My guest is Lieutenant General Robert Dail. He’s been retired since 2008, still remains in tune with what’s happening in the military. And general, as I heard, once a general, always a general, which brings me to the question that I really need an answer for. And that is, how do you become a general? How is it that a soldier or officer can rise up the ranks and become a general in the army or an admiral?

What is the process and what is so unique about that process?

Bob Dail:

Well, I think it’s a very intentional process. And obviously one doesn’t just enter the military and become a general or an admiral. The secretaries don’t just hire right off the street for those positions. And it’s a very intentional process. Each service has their unique qualifications that you would expect regarding skill and operational development knowledge, education. Each of the services lays out an assignment path for their officers, but all of the services follow, it’s quite a similar path in terms of the process. The jobs might be a little bit different in each of the services, but the process is pretty much the same. Most admirals and generals are promoted to one star after serving on average of about two and a half decades. It’s a long time to produce a senior leader in the military today. A young officer enters a respective service as an ensign or a second lieutenant right out of school.

They learn the basic functions of their organization. They learn tactics and how to lead small units. And after they’ve done that, officers who have demonstrated the potential for advancement. In other words, every step of the way on this path, officers are being assessed for their performance. In other words, how well they’re doing their current job, and have they mastered the skills? And then they’re also promoted based on their potential for increased responsibility and command. So as they move up through the chain of command, they attend professional schools that begin to broaden their focus to operational matters, to theaters around the world and our combative commands, commands such as US Central Command or Pacific Command. And these officers get an opportunity to serve in those commands, or they might also have an opportunity to go to the Pentagon in Washington where they can be part of the management and leadership of major programs in their own services or in the joint community.

And at some point in their command, in their career, they will be offered command at the commander level in the Navy and maritime services, or at the lieutenant colonel level and the other services of battalions and ships, squadrons, regiments, and those kinds of organizations. And if they’re successful at those commands, then they’re offered additional schooling at the senior service college levels. And at senior service college, they’re exposed to strategy, national resourcing and matters of readiness. And this is the first time when they would become introduced to maybe civil servants and in the Pentagon that have political appointments, they may have time to meet congressional staffers during this period of their careers and start to understand better and deeper how the constitution has set up the civilian control of the military. They then move on. If they are demonstrating potential, they can go in and command at the colonel level or the Navy captain level, larger ships, larger organization, brigades.

And so after they perform these commands, the services convene promotion boards that are comprised of senior generals, one, two, and three star generals, and they select the very best records. Those offices who’ve demonstrated the highest potential for increased service as a general officer or an admiral, and they are promoted to one stars. And about three or four years later in their career, the one stars are then assessed and for their promotion by another promotion board to two star. Now, when a general or admiral becomes or is selected as a two star, that is the last time that a promotion board from their own service will promote them.

Three and four star generals and admirals are appointed to specific jobs that they have been deemed to be well qualified to serve in, and they go through a recommendation, nomination, and a confirmation process that involves the executive branch, the Secretary of War, the President of the United States who nominates respective officers for appointment to three and four star positions, and then the Senate Armed Services Committee make their recommendation and vote to move the officer’s name to the full Senate where each three and four star officer is confirmed by the full vote of the US Senate. It’s a process that’s been in place since the beginning of our country, and it ensures civilian control of the military. But I would also underscore that it is a process that I just laid out, ensures that America’s troops, the men and women that are in the ranks, it ensures that they get the very best leaders, that a nation like the United States can provide for its troops.

When an officer gets through that process, promotion boards to the one and two star level, when they get appointed and confirmed, the checks and balances that they must go through to be confirmed for the duty of a three or four star admiral or general, it makes sure that we really do get the very best to lead our nation’s troops. In the end, a one star general might serve three to five years. A two star general, if he’s promoted or she’s promoted to two stars might end up serving anywhere between five and seven years. And three and four star admirals and generals can serve anywhere in their entire time as a general or admiral, anywhere between nine to 12 years. So it’s about it ends up if three and four star admirals and generals end up spending almost a third of their career as an admiral or general.

So it’s a very, very unique process and it’s a very fair process. Having gone through it myself, having been before Congress and interviewed and have sat promotion boards for other generals and other generals in the army, I can absolutely say that it is a fair system and it’s one that has many checks and balances to make sure that it’s getting the very, very right people.

Jamie Mitchell:

Bob, we got a couple of minutes left. I got a couple of quick questions if you know this answer, how many generals are in our military today?

Bob Dail:

Well, I don’t know the total number, and I don’t know the exact number of army generals today. The exact number of generals is prescribed by congressional law, and it changes, I guess, from time to time as the services expand and contract. But when I was on active duty in the Army, there was a total of roughly about 310 to 315 generals in the United States Army. And by law, one half of those generals back when I was serving, had to be brigadier generals. And of course, that restriction enabled the army to maintain balance in how it structured its general officer corps. But the Navy and the Air Force, the Marine Corps, Coast Guard, Space Force, they all have congressional limits on how many generals and admirals can serve on active duty, and then how many can serve also in the guard. The number I gave you was for active duty generals.

Jamie Mitchell:

Bob, we hear about one, two, three, four stars generals. It doesn’t go higher than a four star. Has there ever been a five star general? Tell me the history behind that.

Bob Dail:

Well, yes. In World War II, the United States Military, President Roosevelt and the Congress approved the fact that you could have five star ranked admirals and generals, General Marshall, General Eisenhower, Bradley, MacArthur, Hap Arnold, Admiral Nimitz, Admiral Halsey, King. I mean, they were all approved to be five star ranked officers and they were the highest officers that we had in the military coming out of World War II. General Washington, by Order of Congress, has been deemed to be the highest general ever. He outranks every general or admiral that has ever served in the United States military by congressional law back during Gerald Ford’s time, President Ford. But we’ve had higher, but the chairman of the Joint Chiefs is a four star ranked officer, and he is the highest by … He’s the most senior among the four stars, and he is the senior ranking general or officer admiral in the United States military today.

And he provides his best advice and counsel, military advice to the president of the United States and through the Secretary of War.

Jamie Mitchell:

Wow. Absolutely fascinating. Boy, it just encourages me to hear about our military, how well organized and careful it is. Over the years, I’ve met a lot of distinguished officers, and all of them serve with honor, dignity, and love for our country. No matter the rank, what’s fascinating is to see this side of our military. When we come back, why did the DOD call itself now? The Department of War. What’s happening in the news that we need to understand? General Dail’s going to give us some insights. Stay with us here. Stand in the gap today. Thanks for staying with us. I guess I should admit I’ve never served in the military. I’m not really sure why I didn’t because we, as a family, we loved the military. My dad served in World War II. As a kid, our family had a good friend who taught at West Point, Colonel Oli Olson, and we went to the Academy numbers of time, witnessed the grandeur of that place.

And then 20 years ago, maybe 25 years ago, I conducted a walkthrough the Bible seminar at the chapel at West Point. It was a thrilling experience and walked away impacted by the discipline and devotion and the seriousness it is to serve in our military. And so when I watch the news and I see things pop up about the military, and even as General Dail has already shared about how wonderful some of the military operations have turned out in the last couple of months, I take special notice of it because I just love our military. And General Bob Dail is our guest today giving insight from a general point of view. Bob, I have to tell you, the last year, the two major things that have happened regarding our military, I want you to give us some understanding. First, is the name change, now the Department of War.

Why was that? And then there was a gathering of all the top military brass in Washington with Secretary Hegseth to lay out vision, the expectations, values. But first, could you just weigh in, why the name change to the Department of War? What’s behind that?

Bob Dail:

Well, Jamie, that’s a good question. I would say first of all, that the Department of Defense was never named the Department of War. So it’s not something that we would go back to. Actually, the United States Army was originally the Department of War back to the days of Henry Knox when George Washington formed his first government, but the Department of War was changed to the Department of the Army as part of the National Security Act of 1947. General President Truman and the Congress got together, the Department of the Air Force was created, the Department of Defense was created along with the National Security Council and the CIA. That act created the Department of Defense and it was never … The Department of War was retired and was in the history books until this past year when it was named, the Department of Defense was named the Department of War.

And I don’t really know why that was. I’m no longer on active duty and I’m not privy to any of the discussions that were behind that change, but it was changed to the Department of War. And I would just surmise as a retired general that perhaps the new administration wanted to send a stronger sense of will and determination to adversaries. And again, I’m just surmising I have nothing in any knowledge to know why they would rename the Department of Defense into the Department of War. But again, the United States Army used to be the Department of War, and then it was changed to the Department of the Army in 1947. Now, I think you also asked about the … Or you were going to ask about the other major development, which was the major meeting of general officers and admirals in Washington. Is that correct?

Jamie Mitchell:

Yeah. I mean, it seems like, and again, I’m sitting back, you have been in the middle of this. It seems like there’s a tone change that’s trying to be cultivated or ignited within the military. Secretary Hegseth is so pro soldier, he speaks of them as warriors, as our best of the best. He wants to bring a tone to it. And so then we see this mass gathering of the senior leadership. And obviously you weren’t there because you’re retired, but general, why do that? What was trying to be communicated? And I’m not looking for you to tell tales out of turn or to give up any national secrets, but what was behind that, do you think?

Bob Dail:

Well, I think that you touched a little bit on it. I think that anytime you change administrations and anytime that you have a change in senior leadership, people try to look at the culture in any organization, whether you’re in the civilian world or whether you’re in the military. And I think that Secretary Hegseth did convene and call for a meeting of the generals and admirals to Quantico so that he could talk to all of them and convey how he wanted to shift the culture of the organization. Aside from the fact of whatever way he wanted to change it, I want to just make sure that your listeners understand a couple of things about the military. Whenever there’s a major shift in policy in any of the armed forces, Navy, Army, Air Force, Marine Corps, senior leaders traditionally have called for other senior leaders in the chain.

A chief of staff in the army might call a large number of general officers together so that he can put out what he would call chain teaching. In other words, I’m going to give you my change in policy or I’m going to underscore my policies regarding any number of issues, training, readiness, maintenance, whatever that might be, but he wants to do it at one time so all of the admirals and the generals can hear it. And it’s been effective. When I was in the army, there were several times when the entire army went through change and from the chief of staff down through a different series of meetings and new policy, new cultural shifts were underscored to the leaders. So it’s not uncommon to want to gather your key leaders of the organization to put out major policy changes, major cultural changes that the top leaders want to convey and put out to the troops.

He probably wants to make sure that there’s no confusion, that there’s clarity, that no one can say, “Well, I wasn’t there in person to hear it. ” Or he may not want anybody to change the meaning of his words as it’s promulgated down through the force. That’s the only thing I can say. It’s not unusual to have gatherings like that, but I think it’s very clear whether you agree with it or not. I think that the secretary was trying to make sure that there was a cultural shift occurring by the current administration and that he wanted to get that out in a very clear, unconfusing way to his top leadership.

Jamie Mitchell:

Bob, it’s the fact that the United States military is the greatest military force in the world. I just can’t even think that anybody would even try to question that. In our first segment at the end there, you were telling about how wonderful that our military has acted in Iran and Venezuela and then stopping these drug cartels and all of this. We have had win after win after win these last few months and we’re showing the excellence of the United States military, but then you see some other things in the news. And let me just ask this question. Bob, have you ever gotten an illegal order while you were a general and have you ever given an illegal order? I mean, this has been in the news. Well- What’s the deal with this?

Bob Dail:

First of all, I know it’s been in the news, but I can just speak for myself and then speak for the organizations from which I served. I have never been on the receiving end of an illegal order, and I have never given an illegal order. We swear allegiance to the Constitution of the United States, every soldier, sailor, airmen, Marine, coast guardsman, guardian, we all swear allegiance to the constitution and we agree to … We swear an oath that we will obey the order of the president of the United States and the officers appointed over us. There are so many checks and balances in the system, and there’s so much time spent when you are an officer in the long progression of your assignment path that I covered earlier in our conversation, you’re always reminded that you’re … We are an army and a republic. We are a Navy in a republic, an Air Force in a republic where we take orders from the executives in the civilian side of our government, and we understand what legal and illegal orders are, and everyone takes their responsible position in the chain of command to ensure that we properly discuss and discern orders that are given.

And I cannot think for a second of an order In my career or my experience where I’ve had any kind of illegal orders provided to me at all.

Jamie Mitchell:

Well, that’s encouraging to hear. I didn’t even question that because listening to how you explained how methodical and meticulous the military is that in many respects, General, you’re trained to say, “This is not right. I’m not doing this. This can’t go. This can’t happen.” And so kind of right in the veins, the veins of our United States military is never to listen to, accept or give illegal orders. I know it could happen. We live in a depraved world, but the fact of the matter is we are protected. And I’m so encouraged to hear. One of the outcomes that I want today is for us to pray for our military, for our strategic leaders. Pray for the president, vice president, Secretary Hegseth. All of our generals pray for our military. We rely on them for freedom and liberty, and we love them, and we need to pray for them.

Now, listen, when we wrap up, what it’s like to be a believer in Jesus Christ in the military, General Dail’s going to give us an insight. Stay with us. Well, I just want to remind our listening audience, and especially to tell your pastor and your church leaders. Remember, February 1st is return to God Sunday. There are plenty of resources and help on our website, Americanpastors.net. That’s one of two special Sundays we do each year, and we support the local church. Return to God Sunday in February. And then right around 4th of July, we have Liberty Sunday where we again talk about the virtues of freedom and liberty and what this nation has done in honoring the Lord and acknowledging that it is in God we trust as a nation. You can find all those things on our website, our app, pass that along. And I hope this program’s been informative today.

Many thanks to our guest, General Bob Dail, who has helped us understand the military, how it works and what’s happening in the ranks of the world’s greatest arm forces. General, I know you love this nation, you love this country, you love the military, but you also love the Lord, your God, with all your heart. You’ve been very vocal about your faith. Yet we have heard in past administrations cases of discrimination against people of faith who were serving. Was there some anti-Christian sentiment in the military? I know a lot of people in the military who loved the Lord, but was that part of a woke culture that had infiltrated the government? What is the disposition in the military towards people of faith?

Bob Dail:

Well, I appreciate that question, Jamie. And again, I’ve been out of the military now for about 14, 15 years. But I would just say this, as a Christian man who happened to have a professional career in the army, I can say that my colleagues and friends, my superiors, I think that they knew that I was practicing my faith at all times, but I think what they really wanted to make sure of is that I was competent, professional. And so the first thing I would say in the military, if you’re a Christian, you want to be the best professional that you can be. You want to be the best soldier, sailor, airman, Marine that you can be. I can say that I never personally experienced any official pushback or censorship regarding any matter pertaining to my own personal faith. My chain of command was always allowing me to exercise my own personal faith.

I was always able and free to give my testimony at a prayer breakfast. It was sanctioned by the chaplains of our organization. I was always … I even did that in the desert, in desert storm. I went up to the front lines to give a prayer of breakfast testimony to the Cavalry Squadron in the 24th Infantry Division. But I guess my view was always Matthew 5:16, “Let your light shine in such a way that men may see your good works and glorify your Father who is in heaven.” I tried to live that daily. And I think that I often failed to do what I needed to be doing, but I kept on keeping on. And I think everyone who served with me knew that my personal faith was very important to me and it was never restricted. I found that most of the officers appreciated my transparency and I would underscore again that the army allowed me to practice my personal faith.

And then when I was a leader and I was a commander, I executed my responsibility to ensure that all of my subordinates could freely exercise their respective faith or lack thereof. But I would just say that we’ve got a great military and I think that’s still one of the things that I sense that we still have, the ability for a Christian man or woman to be a great professional and the greatest military in the world. And I would just close it and say that General of the Army George C. Marshall gave a speech at Trinity College in 1941. And even he said, the soldier’s heart, the soldier’s spirit, the soldier’s soul is everything. And unless the soldier’s soul sustained him, he cannot be relied upon and will fail himself, his commander or his country. And I believe wholeheartedly to today, our admirals and generals on active duty would not disagree with what General Marshall said in 1941.

We have a great military and many, many people in its ranks are just born again believers and they know Jesus Christ.

Jamie Mitchell:

You know, General, I was sitting at a conference last summer and I happened to sit at a table for dinner with a military chaplain and I was really probing, asking a lot of questions. I was just fascinated. And he had been a chaplain for years and he said to me, he said, “Something has happened within the military.” He said, “I can’t keep up getting resupplied with Bibles.” He said, “Our soldiers, our military, they want Bibles. They want to read Bibles. I’ve had more serious conversations. I got more guys coming to Bible study. There’s something happening and I got to believe that part of it is that in this past year, they have begun a monthly worship service at the Pentagon. And listen, we’re not forcing Christianity on anybody. They’re free to come or go, but there’s something that warms my heart, as it probably does yours, Bob, when you hear that there is a sense of honoring the creator and God Almighty in the ranks of the military.

Bob, one final word. How can we pray for those who love Christ or in the military, but how do we pray, especially for the men and the women in the upper ranks of our great military?

Bob Dail:

Well, I think I appreciate you asking about that. I think we need to continue to pray, have your listeners pray for the admirals and generals, our senior leaders who are serving today in the Pentagon, in the field, on the sea and in the air, pray that God would bless them with wisdom, that he would strengthen them in their duty. It is tough. It’s a relentless, stressful job to be a senior leader in the United States military. They’re uniquely prepared to take on these duties, but we would just pray God’s wisdom and strength for them and that in their decision making, that he would allow them to have a positive impact directly on our troops. And I think we should also pray for enlisted in officers in the military who shoulder the greatest risk as they protect and defend the constitution and the nation. We just have to ask God to put his hand and protect them as they risk their lives and are prepared to risk their lives for this country and pray for their families who are there to support them.

We just, like you say, we’ve got the greatest military in the world. It serves the greatest country. It defends our great people and we’re just so honored. The greatest honor is to serve the nation and as a Christian, be able to walk the talk and give all glory and honor and blessing to the good Lord.

Jamie Mitchell:

Amen. General Bob Dail, bless you for your service, for your leadership, for your testimony. And friends, again, I’m asking that today you take a moment, you pray for our military and all who lead it. I just want you to grasp this today. There’s a general, there’s an admiral that having to make the decision to send one of our precious treasures, our military, into maybe combat, into a place that their life may be in danger and they have to live with that decision that weighs heavy on our generals, on our admirals, on our chief of staff, on our secretary headstone. Liberty needs to be defended and pray that God will give them courage as he needs to give us. And as I end every day, as I’m on here, live and lead with courage. We need godly people of courage. Have a great rest of your day and a great week.

God bless you. Thanks for listening.