Fitting the Pieces Together: Israel, Biblical Prophecy, and the Current Conflict

Host: Hon. Sam Rohrer

Guest: Chris Katulka

Note: This transcript is taken from a Stand in the Gap Today program aired on 3/18/26. To listen to the podcast, click HERE.

Disclaimer: While reasonable efforts have been made to provide an accurate transcription, the following is a representation of a mechanical transcription and as such, may not be a word for word transcript. Please listen to the audio version for any questions concerning the following dialogue.

Sam Rohrer:

Hello and welcome to this Wednesday edition of Stand The Gap Today. And it’s also our bi-monthly emphasis on Israel, the Middle East and biblical prophecy. My returning guest today is Chris Katulka. He is the vice president of North American Ministries of the Friends of Israel Gospel Ministry and the host of the Friends of Israel Today radio program. They have their website and I’ll give it again, but their website is at Israelmyglory.org. All right. Well, let’s move into our theme. We’re now on the 19th day, the 19th day with no clear end in sight. The world’s attention is daily drawn to the Middle East and to Israel and her neighbors as the current US Israel war with Iran unfolds. That’s the 19th day. We’re now that far into it, just about three weeks. And that the great majority of the world’s nations and populations who oppose Israel grow in number, it seems, and literally it doesn’t seem it is.

And the few who stand with Israel have shrunk. For students of God’s word and biblical prophecy, this fact should not be a surprise. Yet understanding where we are in terms of biblical prophecy and God’s unfolding plan of redemption, though blurry for centuries is certainly increasingly coming into focus. From the perspective of God’s word, Israel will increasingly be the world’s focus. As Jerusalem and Israel, Jewish people generally becomes, but particularly Jerusalem and Israel, that physical location becomes a burdensome stone for all nations. And anybody who tries to fix it will be crushed by it. We’re told that in Zechariah. Now, the events of the last seven years of human history prior to the beginning of the thousand year millennial kingdom or the millennial reign, that tribulation period, that’s the seven years prior tribulation period as it refers to the Gentile nations with the time of Jacob’s trouble, as it specifically refers to God’s purposes for Israel.

It does revolve around Israel and God’s plan to chastise that yet unbelieving nation of Israel and the Jewish people who have not yet recognized that Jesus is the Messiah. You say why? Well, because the Jewish people and the nation as a whole are in the land as we speak right now, though they are there in unbelief. So there’s things that have to happen prophetically. They still refuse to recognize Jesus as Messiah. So God will fulfill his covenant with Abraham, not because of Abraham’s faithfulness with the Jews’ faithfulness to God, but because of God’s faithfulness to his covenant. That’s why it’s going to be fulfilled. And during that process, we’ll bring back a final one third of the Jewish people. Two thirds are going to lose their lives in that period of time. It’s an incredible time. But the Bible tells us a third of the Jewish people will ultimately cry out and say, “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.” As Jesus four tells in Matthew chapter 23 and verse 39.

And at that time, the very conclusion of God’s great wrath that’ll happen right at the end of the tribulation period, Christ will return to Jerusalem and he will establish his literal thousand year reign where then King Jesus physically will sit in a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem and reign over all the kingdoms of this earth. Thy kingdom come, thy will be done. That’s what it means for a thousand years. And this time, he will demonstrate for the first time what godly government and true justice actually looks like. But until then, the days in which we live are going to be increasingly lawless, corrupt, deceived, increasingly anti-Christ and anti-Semitic. But fitting together the many moving pieces is an effort all true believers I think should truly consider and look at every day as we look through the lens of scripture and focus and look back on history, historical aspects as it regards now this current war with Iran.

The title I’ve chosen to frame this conversation between myself today and special guest Chris Katulka is this, fitting the pieces together, Israel, biblical prophecy and the current conflict. And with that, Chris, welcome back to the program. Just always great to have you back.

Chris Katulka:

Sam, thanks so much and it’s great to be with you again. Got a lot to talk about today.

Sam Rohrer:

Yeah, we do. So let’s move right into it. From an overall perspective, Chris, there are many confusing and conflicting aspects of this current war with Iran. Israel truly has blacked out most media coverage, so it’s not really known very much what’s actually happening on the ground. White House is attempting to control their version of the war. Iran and other media are shaping their narrative of the war, and the result is most people have no confidence as to what is actually happening, why it’s happening, or when to anticipate when it may end. So my first question to you is why it opened. From your personal perspective, as you look at this war now 19 days old, what are your most significant observations regarding the stated reasons for the war and the stated objectives of the war?

Chris Katulka:

Well, the two allies that are working together to accomplish the goal in Iran, I think actually have two different objectives, even though they’re working for the same reason. And here’s what I mean by that. It’s Israel and America. America has to, of course, the president, Donald Trump, he has to approach this from a national security perspective, which of course is Iran’s ballistic and nuclear missiles capability. And so of course, that’s going to be the angle that he’s going to come at as much as he possibly can and those in his administration. I would say that Israel’s is the same, but theirs is more targeted, I actually believe toward regime change, because that’s what they need the most for their national security is regime change. I think they’re helping each other as much as possible. I know that the United States, for instance, helped Israel with intelligence in order to find key leaders like the Ayatollah, like the IRGC leaders, and those that are a part of the Islamic regime, the leadership there, and even the sub levels of leadership.

American Israel, we’re working together to accomplish that, but I do believe that Sam, they’re coming at it from almost two different perspectives where the US wants to make sure it’s communicating as clearly as possible. We want to make sure we eliminate the existential threat that Iran poses on the United States. And I would even say on the Western world, and as we’re even seeing on the entire Middle Eastern world as well, and then Israel, again, with the same desire, but I think theirs is more targeted toward eliminating the regime that’s in control, the Ayatollahs and the IRGC to provide a pathway for change in regime. I don’t know what that’s going to look like or how that’s going to play out because there’s so many variables when it comes to regime change in Iran. I mean, we have everything from potential military leaders that could take control.

We don’t really know whether or not the son of the Ayatollah, Majdaba Kameni is even alive right now, but he apparently is the leader. He’s another Ayatollah, all the way to the more secular leaning Rezapalavi, the exiled crown prince of Iran, who’s, I believe, living in the United States. So again, what that’s going to look like, I don’t quite know how it’s all going to pan out. I think everybody’s eyeing for that position of leadership there, but I do believe that the stated goals for the US is national security for our country based solely on eliminating the threat that Iran poses toward us. And I actually think Israel is going full throated to make sure they take out the

Sam Rohrer:

Regime and try to get there. All right. With that, Chris, ladies and gentleman stay with us, we’re going to come back and we’re going to go further into it. Looking back now at the history of Iran and its biblical destiny. All right. If you’re just joining us today, welcome aboard. This is our Wednesday, our bimonthly focus on Israel, the Middle East and biblical prophecy. And if you’ve listened to this program, let’s put it this way, if you’re new to this program, you may not be aware that when this program began many, many years ago, we began intentionally every other Wednesday as much as possible, and haven’t missed very many of those times, the focus on Israel, the Middle East, and biblical prophecy. And we actually began doing that way back with the late Dr. Jimmy DeYoung. Some of you remember that. He’s now home with the Lord, but we did it for one reason and we said very clearly.

Why do that? Why speak about prophecy? Well, because that’s what the Bible’s full of. God does. And why speak about Israel? Well, because God’s redemptive plan, prophesied first in Genesis 3:15 is worked through the nation of Israel, the Jewish people, and God’s holy city, which is called in scripture, holy city of Jerusalem, eternal city. That’s what scripture says. So it’s very difficult if we’re going to be biblically focused, and as we do in this program, consider headline news through the filter and the lens of scripture to not, by frequency and intentionality, focus on the things that comprise the focus of the word of God. So that’s why we do it. And so I just wanted to put that out there. My guest today is, again, is Chris Katulka is the vice president of North American Ministries of the Friends of Israel Gospel Ministry. He also hosts their program, The Friends of Israel Today program, and they have a website at Israelmyglory.com that you can visit to find more information.

All right. Now we’re talking about Israel. Obviously I have a war going on 19th today here. The United States is joined with Israel with a focus on Iran. And as we just talked about in the last program, the goals of Israel are not necessarily the goals of the United States. And there’s actually more involved than even what Chris, you mentioned in that last segment. There’s money involved, there’s the American dollar involved, there’s the oil connection to the US dollar and the economic component that’s been an issue. We didn’t even get into that and we’re not right now, but the point being, there are multiple motives and goals that happen to be aligning. And that’s one of the things about biblical prophecy that happens. But let’s talk about Iran here now and what the Bible says. Let me get a bit of a history. In March of 1935, Reza Shah Palavi requested that all foreign governments begin to use the name Iran in formal correspondence.

Prior to that time, and even for some time after that, 1935 now, what we now refer to as Iran, which by definition, by the way, means the land of the Aryans was historically known by its biblical reference of Persia. And according to most historians officially founded by Cyrus the Great in 550 BC, though the land and the peoples of Persia, now Iran, have historical roots going back much prior to Cyrus, the great. That being the case, so the history’s deep and the contributions to human history by the people of Persia, now Iran, is very significant. So Chris, add in anything you want to that, but I want to go here as well and ask you to share the significant points of nexus between Persia of the Old Testament and Israel of the Old Testament because the relationship of Persia, Iran to Israel is longstanding. Do that first and then a description of the relationship between the nation of Persia and the nation of Israel and the Jewish people up to the time of Messiah’s first coming.

We’ll take that chunk of time first.

Chris Katulka:

Yeah, this is a great place to start for even understanding the history of Iran, the Persian people. Again, our mentality of Iran is often built on what we see coming out of Tehran and those religious fanatics that are leading it, when really that’s not even really the heartbeat of the Persian people, the common Persian people. And there is a unique nexus that connects Israel and Iran or Persia together. And that of course goes back to the Bible. As you mentioned 2,500 plus years ago, Cyrus the Great did something absolutely amazing. His name was mentioned in the prophet Isaiah. His purpose was given. In fact, he was called the anointed one by God himself because he would accomplish something and do something for God that is one of the most amazing aspects of prophecy fulfilled that God would return his people to the land after exile.

After the Babylonians under Nebuchadnezzar kicked the Jewish people out of their homeland, Judah and the Assyrians out of the northern 10 tribes of Israel, it would be through Cyrus the great in about 538 BC who would issue an edict. And that Edict is actually found on one of the most famous archeological tablets. It’s actually a cylinder called the Cyrus Cylinder that I believe you can still go to the British Museum and see for yourself. And in that Cyrus cylinder, it actually matches up perfectly with the edict that was given to Ezra and Ezra chapter one, when Cyrus gave permission for the Jewish people to return to their homeland and to rebuild a temple. And it’s actually interesting, you had just mentioned, we have been talking about Rezapalavi, you were just mentioning his father there, the Shah, and there’s this exiled crown prince. His father actually celebrated in 1971, he celebrated the tolerance of the Iranian people, believe it or not, in 1971 by honoring Cyrus the great and Persepolis, which is the city, used to be the capital, and also the Cyrus cylinder.

And that’s kind of where the nexus of Persia and Israel exist. God used a Gentile pagan, yeah, a pagan Gentile empire in order to return his people back to the land according to what the prophets had promised. And so again, that’s kind of the nexus point. And even the exile Crown Prince recently said in a statement to his people and to the Israelis as well that only two people that have a really biblical connection to the land are the Jewish people and also the Persian people. And so he even sees that connection in the Bible and the work that Cyrus the Great did to return Israel to their ancient homeland. As for more the modern under leading up to Jesus’ birth as first coming, it’s interesting to see Cyrus becomes the one who would ultimately allow the Jewish people to return, but that doesn’t mean it would be easy for them once they return.

You just have to read Ezra and Nehemiah. In fact, there would be subsequent kings and successors of Cyrus the great who wouldn’t necessarily have a liking to Israel or the Jewish people at that time in the rebuilding, making it more difficult for them. And in fact, the Jewish people begin to lose their way as a result of the … In Yiddish, there’s a word Cyrus, the trouble that would come as a result of those kings that would follow after Cyrus, the great … Sam, I see a lot of connections, and maybe we can go here as well. I often see a lot of connections between what happened in 538 DC when Cyrus returned the Jewish people to the land. And actually what happened in 1948 when the UN, the United Nations, a bunch of Gentile nations returned the Jewish people, gave them permission to return to their homeland as well.

I see a lot of interesting connections there that I don’t think that we should just simply overlook.

Sam Rohrer:

Okay. No, I don’t think we should either. So that was the past friendly, not always friendly up to the time of Christ coming, but then Israel was scattered. The prophecy said that Israel would be scattered, which they have been for 2000 years approximately. And then God brought them back into the land in 1948. And then we have this relationship, as you’re describing, changing, moving a little bit now to the point where you have in Persia that is hostile to Israel. Don’t have too much time here, but build it out a little bit because from our time, marked by the beginning of the nation of Israel, 1948, to the end of the time of Jacob’s trouble, when I’ve heard earlier, a remaining one third of Jewish people, the remnant will repent and recognize Jesus to be Yeshua, the prophesied Messiah. What role will the nation of Israel or modern day Iran play in this window of time in which we’re looking up to that time when the remnant actually calls out to Jesus as Messiah?

Chris Katulka:

Yeah. Right now we’re getting a sense that within Persia, there are a lot of Iranians, I should say Iran. There’s a lot of Iranians who actually love Israel. Israel and Persia actually had a amazing relationship prior to the Iranian revolution in 1979. The Iranian people, the vast majority of them have a great deep appreciation for Israel and even for Benjamin Netanyahu, believe it or not. And so there is a deep connection that’s there. But when we look at biblical prophecy, I always like to remind people, you had mentioned Zechariah chapter 14 earlier, and in that same section in the very beginning in the first three verses of Zachariah 14, it actually says that all of the nations of the world turn on Jerusalem. That Jerusalem, like you said, becomes a stumbling block or it’s like a cup of reeling that all the nations have to be drawn toward.

And that’s what we’re seeing right now as we look at the events that are taking place. All of the eyes are on Israel. And I think we might even be talking about this in a little bit. Not only are all eyes on Israel, but there is a huge reduction. There’s been a decrease in support for Israel, not just in Europe or around the world, in the United States as well, because of the wars that they’ve been fighting against their enemies. And so, it’s going to be interesting to see how all of these nations are centered right on Jerusalem right now. They’re looking at what’s happening, and it’s this tiny state that sits on the eastern side of the Mediterranean Sea. So I think all the nations are heading in that direction.

Sam Rohrer:

And thank you, Chris. And ladies and gentlemen, stay with us. I hope this is interesting to you because it’s certainly not something you’re going to hear on Fox News. I guarantee you that, or CNN or CBS or any place else. But these are the pieces that, without knowing this, you can’t make sense of what’s happening around us. But with these in place and knowing what the word of God says, it allows the pieces to come together and we sit back and say, “Wow, isn’t it great what God’s doing?” Our theme today and our focus is this, fitting the pieces together, Israel, biblical prophecy, and the current conflict. What current conflict? The war that’s happening in the Middle East, Israel, the United States, Iran, a broadening engagement of other nations, but what’s the point? The focus is on Israel and increasingly on those that are either with them, one degree or another, or opposed to them.

And well, the majority are opposed and increasingly, we’ll have a little bit of discussion on that with special guests here today, Chris Katulka. But coming at it from a little additional prophetical perspective here, from a true believer’s perspective, ladies and gentlemen, I’m saying that a true believer, we know we’ve talked about that before. 70% of Americans self-identify as Christians, but when you get right down to it, those who actually say the word of God is authoritative, Jesus Christ did in fact live a sinless, human, earthly life. You start narrowing it down and you’re down to about three to four, maybe 5% at the most George Barn would say 3% of those who are truly born again. Now that’s an incredible thing, but it’s also a sign of our times. But that being said, with that in mind, so when I say true believer, that’s what I mean.

From a true believer’s perspective, we understand that scripture is God’s revelation of his plan. It’s his story. His plan of redemption and the written expression of himself. How do we know who God is through the word of God? Jesus Christ when he came is the physical embodiment of the truth and he is called the way, the truth and the life. He says that. He is the word. We’ll find that in the first part of the book of John and many other places. He is the word. Together with the recorded words of Christ at his first coming, those things we find in the gospels and so forth, the revelation of Jesus Christ as revealed to the apostle John and the book of Revelation, because if you read the book of Revelation, it is the revelation of Jesus Christ. So the book of Revelation are the words of Jesus Christ as delivered through the Apostle John.

These together provide the information that Christ wants his people to know about the latter years and the end days of which we are clearly in. And we’ve talked about that and why we can say that with confidence. In addition, the word of God tells us of the conclusion of the times of the Gentiles, that’s a frame time, the church age that’s referenced in Luke 21 to 24, and actually goes up into the tribulation time, the time of the Gentiles, but the details of the time of tribulation, that seven year period, the final redemption of the nation of Israel, the second coming of Christ, the millennial rule of Christ, the great white throne judgment, and then the eternal state with the new Jerusalem and the new heaven and new earth, all of that is within the book of Revelation with reference back to prophetical utterances and written word from the prophet Daniel all the way back in the Book of Daniel.

Now, that being the case, Chris, along the path of human civilization since creations about 6,000 years ago, all those who fear God have taken the knowledge that God has given and lived accordingly. For us today, we have the complete word of God, the complete revelation of Jesus Christ and the book of Revelation. We have the ability because of the Holy Spirit and has up to look back, to look around and observe the signs given by Jesus to the disciples of what we should expect and see, and actually coming into fulfillment, I think, in a remarkable way. Now, here’s my question to you. To what extent do you see the political leaders of, I’m going to go here first, Israel today, making decisions either consciously or unconsciously in an alignment with the knowledge of biblical prophecy, and if so, how do you describe that?

Chris Katulka:

Yeah, and this is a fantastic question because it’s connected to the sovereignty of God and how God works in the world. You had mentioned earlier, really eloquently, that as followers of Jesus, we have revelation from God, his word. So we have a perspective that only God could give us on how things are going to work from the beginning to the end, and we trust in that. But that doesn’t mean that those who don’t have the revelation from God, that aren’t followers of the Lord, are acting out of God’s plans to move forward his plan of redemption. I’ll go back to Cyrus the Great. We had mentioned Cyrus the Great earlier, Sam, and we talked about the fact that he accomplished what God wanted him to do as a Gentile, yes, even pagan ruler. And what happened, he returned the Jewish people to the land. But if you actually look at the historical background to it, yes, he returned the Jewish people to the land, but he also returned any peoples that were exiled by the Babylonians.

So Cyrus worked, even though he was a pagan, he still worked in accordance to what God was accomplishing, even though I don’t believe he necessarily had the revelation from God, God gave him that will to move forward to accomplish what he wanted to do and in the middle of that was God’s purposes. The same thing I could say for what you look at when it comes to any leader in the world, especially Israel. Israel is an incredibly divided country when it comes to politics. Whenever people say, “I don’t support Israel if I don’t agree with their government.” No, that’s not what I’m saying. Israelis disagree with their government all day long, Sam. That’s all they do is disagree. They have dozens of political parties. We have two, they have dozens of them. And so when you’re talking about the leadership in Israel, there is one thing that they all agree on right now, whether they’re progressive, whether they’re conservative or moderates, however you want to label them, they all agree that Iran is an existential threat to not only Israel, but to the entire Middle East as well.

And so are they working in accordance to what God wants to see accomplished? I don’t necessarily believe that they’re going to what the scriptures might teach about it. Maybe some of the more religious are looking into the Torah or the prophets or the writings of the Hebrew Bible, but I don’t necessarily think the vast majority of Israelis are looking at this even from a biblical perspective, but they are accomplishing, I believe,

What was meant to be done by what God wants to accomplish in the Middle East. The Middle East is changing before our very eyes. We have a front row seat to probably one of the most significant changes of the Middle East in the last 60 or 70 years where Iran could fall and open up a new pathway for what that Middle East could look like. I’m not quite sure, but the common foe of the Middle East is slowly and painfully dying right now. How that’s going to fit into God’s plan, I don’t quite know yet, but I will say I don’t think God is absent from it. I’ll just leave it with this too, since it’s connected to Iran and Persia, same thing could be said for Esther and Haman and King Ahasuerus in the book of Esther. An amazing story of God’s providence and how God was working to preserve and protect his people, and yet here’s what’s important.

God’s name was never mentioned in the book at all for such a time as this.

Sam Rohrer:

And that’s all great. That’s great information, Chris. When I go to scripture, I look and I say, “Well, what do we know from scripture?” Well, in this period of time, do we find Iran as a friend of Israel? No, we don’t. We find them in alignment with Russia and Turkey, Gog, Magog, and their ultimate alignment of other nations when they come down against Israel. And matter of fact, when they do come down against Israel in that war, which may not be all that far off, I’m thinking we’re certainly closer and closer to it, no other nation comes to Israel’s aid. And that means the United States is not there. So things are happening, but we do know how it ultimately ends up. Any comments on that?

Chris Katulka:

Yeah. I always think it’s important to look at the regional and then the global, and we can even look at that in the time of Jacob’s trouble, the seven year tribulation period. It’s all centered on Israel and Jerusalem, but at the same time, the entire world is being judged by God. So the picture, even with the Battle of Gaga Magog, there is a zoomed in picture of the regional tensions that are taking place during that time, but then as time goes on and you zoom out more, the prophet Zechariah says all nations come against Israel. There’s not a single friend left. The only one left to rescue his people at the very end, at the very last moment is Jesus the Messiah. And I always like to say, I believe that the Jewish people will have the Apostle Paul experience. The Apostle Paul didn’t get saved on the road to Damascus by some guy handing him a track and then he came to faith in Jesus.

He actually was approached by Jesus himself. Jesus appeared, revealed himself, the glorified Messiah and King revealed himself to Paul and Paul could do nothing but believed because he revealed himself to Paul. I think the same thing happens to the Jewish people. I think they all have a Paul moment in that last moment

Sam Rohrer:

Where

Chris Katulka:

They look upon him whom they have pierced. That’s what it says in Zechariah chapter 12, verse 10. They will look upon him whom they have pierced. And then Zechariah does the most amazing thing. He labels every single component of Israeli or Jewish life in those who repent from the kings From the elite, to the politicians, to the common worker, and in all of their wives and all of their families, they all repent. It’s not just the men who repent, it’s the entire family who repents. And so you see this national repentance that takes place and how did it happen? Jesus reveals himself. They look upon him whom they have pierced and they repent. And so I think that’s kind of the direction that we’re seeing that you have sometimes this regional tension that’s going on in the prophet Ezekiel. And then you have a global picture of what’s going on in Zephaniah, for instance, in the first chapter, Zephaniah.

And that’s the reason why I always think it’s important for people who believe in replacement theology or their all millennial. Oftentimes they’ll say, Jerusalem will already fell. The temple was destroyed. It’s done. See, they already fulfilled Revelation. They already fulfilled Matthew 24 and 25, the Olivet discourse. God’s done that already. No, no, no. You’re just thinking of Jerusalem falling. The tribulation period is the great tribulation Jesus calls it.

Sam Rohrer:

Okay. And with that, I’m going to have to hold up. We’re out of time. We’ll come back and let you complete that. And then we’ll go into some consideration, ladies and gentlemen, of the remnant. The remnant, the true believer, the God-fearing person. What our responsibility is in these, I’m going to say exciting days. Well, as we go into our final segment here, Chris, in the last segment, we were concluding our discussion about whether a person, a Jewish leader, or a Gentile leader, a leader of our country, or a leader of Iran, or any of the nations of the world, regardless of what they are doing and for what reason in regard to Israel and the Middle East, it is aligning with that which God’s plan has laid out in his word. And that’s the incredible thing about it because God is bringing things to pass.

The devil has tried many times over the years, over the civilization to try and thwart God’s plan in many different ways to do that. But he has not succeeded. He will not succeed, nor will any human leader, Jewish or Gentile, who have not embraced and submitted themselves to the authority of Jesus Christ as king of kings. They’re going to find that whatever it is they think they’re doing will amazingly work out to be exactly what God said was going to work out. That’s an incredible thing. Any final words to say on that before we conclude here?

Chris Katulka:

Yeah. Maybe I can come back sometime in May with your permission, Sam, to talk about the birth of the modern state of Israel, which is exactly what you’re talking about. I always like to highlight two individuals, Theodore Hertzl, who was a secular Jewish man, and then a Bible believing Christian Reverend William Heckler, who saw what Hertzl was trying to accomplish to establish a Jewish state in their ancient homeland as not just something political, but he would tell him as a Christian, as a Bible believing Christian, you’re on a biblical mission, you’re not on a political mission. And I think that’s how God works all the time. And so it doesn’t necessarily just mean that God’s working through the church. God’s working through everybody in order to accomplish his will, even whether or not they’re believers or

Sam Rohrer:

Not.

Chris Katulka:

And that’s a humbling thing to think about the sovereignty of our God.

Sam Rohrer:

It is indeed. We will do that, the Lord willing and may. Chris, I think that would be fantastic. So let’s bring it up in here. The scripture says in many places that in the days in which we live, that deception would mark the day. Jesus talks about that in Matthew 24, just a program earlier in this week. I spent time more fully on that idea that that would increase. And when deception is more prevalent, it clouds the ability of people to think, their ability to observe that which is true. That’s the very nature of deception. Lawlessness scripture says will also increase at the same time, fueled by demonic activity, the unfettered lust for power and money and control and selfish driven desires will prevail. That’s the nature of a God rejecting people and nations. Israel themselves got themselves in that boat, and that’s why God had to judge them as a nation because they did exactly the same thing.

But we’re told also there’ll be a falling away of the professing church as Jesus described to later to see in church in Revelation three. So as we’re focusing on Israel primarily today, and that’s a perspective that you can speak well from. How are Jews who have embraced Jesus as Yeshua? We would call them Messianic Jews. How are Jews who have embraced Jesus as Yeshua, the Messiah, viewing these days and their responsibility to those around them and to other unbelieving Jews? Is that a fair question? Can you answer that?

Chris Katulka:

Yeah. I think it actually goes back to what you and I talked about earlier. If you’re in dwelt with the Holy Spirit, whether you’re Jew or Gentile, you have revelation from God that comes from his word. So for the Jewish believers living in Israel, they are completely aware of what the prophetic teachings say about their nation and about their people and about God’s prophetic plan. And yet at the same time, and they stand with confidence on that rock. They stand with confidence on those words of what God will do in the future. At the same time, they have to think clearly about the threat that Iran poses toward their people. I don’t think there’s too many Bible believing Christians who are Jewish in Israel who would disagree with the fact that there needs to be some type of right now regime change in Iran because Iran poses a constant existential threat to their people.

Hamas was the proxy of Iran. Hezbollah, which is a continued threat to Israel in the North and to Lebanon, it continues to threaten Israel. They’re a proxy of Iran. The Houthis, Islamic Jihad, which is in the Palestinian territories and in Jordan and in Iraq, all of these places are constant threats toward Israel’s existential, towards their existence. And so I think at the same time, the mothers and the fathers that are Jewish believers living in Israel have to think about the fact that they want to make sure they live in some semblance of safety, but also knowing that God is in control, God is the one moving this forward, and they have a revelation from God through the indwelling of the Holy Spirit and reading his word to know what the future holds for their people. And I think they are stuck in that tension until the Lord returns.

And that’s just the nature of what it means to be Israeli and to be an Israeli believer.

Sam Rohrer:

And knowing that, don’t have much time left, but as you said, it is exactly what the Bible says. Whether a person, a born again person, whether they’re Jewish by birth or Gentile by birth, we are told that when we have embraced Yeshua, Messiah, Jesus, the Christ, we are one in Christ. So from your perspective, because what you’re saying there, we can understand people living in Israel, Messianic believers who understand they are seeing their own homes, their country, they have a nation there, and they’re looking at biblical prophecy. What about the Gentiles, the Christians, us who are not living in Israel, what should be our motivation and what’s our responsibility in these critical days?

Chris Katulka:

Hey, Sam, two big things. Number one, get into God’s word. If your listeners are listening, get into God’s word and start looking at God’s plan for Israel and the Jewish people because I believe God is drawing a line in the sand right now when it comes to support for Israel and the Jewish people and the rise of targeted Jewish hatred globally. If you want to know why none of the NATO countries, I believe this, are helping even in just the strait of Hormuz, I don’t think it’s because they don’t want to. I think it’s because Israel’s a part of the conversation as well and an allied attempt to take down the regime in Iran. There is a rising antisemitism and a hatred toward Israel. And I believe it’s going to be up to Christians to draw that God’s drawing that line in the sand on where we stand to stand with Israel and the Jewish people.

God said he will judge the nations based upon how they treated his inheritance, my people and how they divided up my land. Joel chapter three, that’s not even the New Testament. That’s Joel chapter three. And then Jesus picks up on that in Matthew chapter 25. And the second one is this, the gospel, the good news of Yeshua, Hamas Shiak, Jesus, the Messiah, the King of Kings, as you mentioned earlier. My favorite Psalm is Psalm 72. There is a day that’s coming, Psalm 72, when all, every knee will bow, it says in Psalm 72, every king on earth will bow to the king of kings in Jerusalem. And I think that’s the direction that God is taking to us. I think I mentioned this the last time we might have spoken. I believe every single heart that is in dwelt with the Holy Spirit, every person, Christian that’s in dwelt with the Holy Spirit, the Holy Spirit provides a compass and the compass orients us not to Washington, not to all of the governments that we have, Sam, but to Jerusalem.

Our heart should be fixed on Jerusalem because that’s where the king is returning.

Sam Rohrer:

And Chris Katulka, thank you so much for being. We’re right up at the end of the program. Excellent, excellent in every way. Ladies and gentlemen, I hope that at the end of the day, our goal here is that we start with the word of God. We look at that, which is around us through the lens of the word of God, and then we go and we remain anchored in the promises that are in the word of God. And when we do that, our feet will not be moved and we will not be deceived. So I hope that that is something that will help us all as we enter in and leave this program today. Lord willing, we’ll be back here tomorrow and look forward to joining you then.