The Clash of ID’s: Digital Vs. Divine

The Clash of ID’s: Digital Vs. Divine

September 29, 2025

Host: Hon. Sam Rohrer

Guest: Dr. James Spencer

Note: This transcript is taken from a Stand in the Gap Today program aired on 9/29/25. To listen to the podcast, click HERE.

Disclaimer: While reasonable efforts have been made to provide an accurate transcription, the following is a representation of a mechanical transcription and as such, may not be a word for word transcript. Please listen to the audio version for any questions concerning the following dialogue.

Sam Rohrer:

Well, hello and welcome to this Monday edition of Stand In the Gap Today, and it’s also the beginning, as we all know of the last week of September. Hard to believe, but time does march on. As I’ve shared many times, some of the most life-changing and significant events occur during the weekends, the off-cycle media reporting schedule. And the same for this last weekend. We’re not going to go into these, but here are just a couple. For instance, the president ordered Department of War Hegseth to send us troops to Portland, Oregon to protect ICE facilities, as well as saying that that’s going to be done for other ice locations across the nation and approved the use of full military power by those troops, which means frankly, the ability to shoot real bullets. Now, this historic and dangerous decision, in my opinion, despite the opposition of the mayor of Portland and the governor of the state, is something to watch Secretary Hegseth.

Then not necessarily directly related, but I think it likely is called an emergency meeting at Quantico of hundreds of generals from all over the nation. That gathering makes it historic in places all of our top military people in one place for reasons frankly not yet known. And in violation of all previous policy, it’s not been done before. Then there were shootings at churches, an imminent invasion by our military of Venezuela without a declaration of war, as well as reports of trains in Europe headed to the Russian border, loaded with US tanks. These are just a few additional items of grave significance in my opinion that we’ll all bear out and we’ll see more about the in the days ahead. But another area advancing at warp speed is something that’s driving our nation, United States toward a mandatory civilization wide submission to digital biometric IDs. As just announced last week in the United Kingdom by the Prime Minister Starmer there where he said that it’s going to happen and he said, no one’s going to be able to buy or sell without the artificial intelligence enhanced digital IDs also supporting the ever growing presence of AI.

Our president last week before the United Nations announced that he was taking the lead on enacting a biological weapons policy to keep us all safe. How did he say? Through the use of AI technology, which he said, we can trust as reserved, we can trust AI. I can’t. Anyway, it’s the global technology of AI that when merged with individual identifications of IDs or IDs and tens of thousands of low orbiting satellites confirmed by guys like Bill Gates and Elon Musk completes the final stages of global digital prison from which no one can run or hide, and that’s what they say. So I’m glad to have back with me today, Dr. James Spencer, president of the Useful to God Ministry, and also the president of the DL Moody Center to address several key considerations of this developing reality I’m submitting for which all true believers in Jesus Christ must seriously consider. The title I’ve chosen to frame our conversation today is this, the Clash of ID’s,Digital Versus Divine. And with that, Dr. James Spencer, thanks for being back with me.

James Spencer:

Yeah, it was a pleasure. Thanks Sam.

Sam Rohrer:

Dr. Spencer, you and I have discussed various aspects of technology and the challenge it presents and other programs, but the warp speed drive toward a fully controlled system of governance made possible by artificial intelligence databases and their analysis ability to link every human being worldwide and as they say, to ultimately either permit or deny all of life decisions is literally here just waiting, in my opinion, some event to justify a great reset. And these things are all things that they’ve said that the information’s there, health data, transportation data, financial data, buying and selling, all of that they’re saying is able to be controlled. And to me when I say those words, buying and selling in all of those areas, it sounds to me exactly like the Biblically prophesied beast system. Now, what I’d like to talk about today is this clash of technology where all of this system depends on personally identifiable IDs, digital IDs, but to me there’s a contrast there between those who if they’re truly in Christ, we have an identity in Christ, how do these conflict and how they interreact.

So here’s my first question. Obviously if we don’t get this done, we’ll go into the next segment, but what’s in a personal ID? In other words, how valuable is our individual ID, our identification, and how should the current global warp speed effort we’re watching to build a system of AI run technology that is going after every citizen’s ID? How should that influence the thinking of true believers who say, wait a minute here, we’re not going the right direction, but who do know that they have a defined what scripture says, identity in Christ? Put some of those things together please.

James Spencer:

Sure. First, what’s in a personal ID? We can give it personal identifiable information. You’re talking name, date of birth, address certain credentials nowadays like usernames afterwards. And then potentially depending on what’s being collected, could be biometric data like fingerprints or facial recognition. We’ve seen a lot of that happening in cell phones. We’ve seen a lot of that happening with TSA at airports, and we’re sort of subjecting to it out of convenience. It’s easier for me just to follow the process of the airport and do the facial recognition software than it is for me really to do the alternate route of that. So small identifiable information has all of that basic kind of stuff in it. I think it would also include things like any sort of digital, maybe birth certificates, various credentials like driver’s license or health records. It could allow for sharing of selective specific data.

Even something like since you’re on the radio and I do a podcast, Sam, our voices would probably this. So you think about creating a digital representation of who you are. This is where this is kind of going toward. So you’re creating a digital version of yourself with all of this information tied to it. So why is that challenging? Well, it’s challenging on a number of practical levels At some point, people having all this information, what it can lead to, you can lead to. We might think of irreversible data leaks. What happens if all of this information about us get out that creates real practical problems for an individual who now can’t really differentiate their digital self from their physical self? If someone has my fingerprints and digitally can use those to get into different things, if they have my face and they can digitally use that to get into things, how am I supposed to clean that up? I can’t get a new set of fingerprints, I can’t get a new face. So we’re very vulnerable to these systems. It is really problematic and deeply challenging.

Sam Rohrer:

Okay, and with that, Dr. Spencer, just hold that right there. We can’t complete that. We’ll do that in the next segment. Ladies and gentlemen, if you’re just tuning in, we’re talking about actually the clash of IDs digital we’re talking about, but divine identity in Christ. You have one of those too. If you are in Christ, we’re talking about that today. So stay with us. I think this is very practical. It’ll be very informative as well. Well, welcome back ladies and gentlemen, and if you’re just joining us, thanks for being on board with us today. Our theme today is this, talking about digital IDs. You’re seeing a big push for that. It’s almost always connected to artificial intelligence. The title I’ve chosen for today is this, the Clash of ID’s, digital versus Divine. Right now, if you’re a born again child of God, you have an identity in Christ.

That’s the divine identity I’m trying to talk about here. We’re going to do a little compare contrast with this. My special guest today is Dr. James Spencer. He is the president of the Useful to God Ministry with a website@usefultogod.com. He’s also president of the DL Moody Center. Alright, Dr. Spencer, let me go back to you now and have you complete what we began in the last segment. You were talking about digital IDs, the importance of understanding what personal ID is. You were talking about that getting a little bit of ramifications, complete that question that and then compare that to a concern I guess on a side of a divine identity because identity is obviously very critical. Finish that if you don’t mind.

James Spencer:

It really is. So when I think about our divine identity, what I’m thinking about is being made in the image of God. We are to be shaped into the image of Christ and we do that through discipleship. And what I see as part of the danger of all this data collection and the way it’s going to be used to manipulate our behaviors to subtly change our behaviors is that that is a competing mode of discipleship. There is somebody who’s going to have enough of our data, enough information about us that the systems and structures we actually interact with on a day-to-day basis are going to change the way we think and see the world in ways that may not conform to the image of Jesus Christ. And so as we’re interacting with some of these data issues, these are not trivial issues. There’s a great quote from Albert Borgman who wrote on technology and he basically says that technology is going to rule today by constituting the inconspicuous patterns by which we normally orient ourselves, the inconspicuous patterns. These things don’t have to blow up and become nuclear problems. They can be the inconspicuous patterns that are slowly nudging us away from Jesus and towards something else. And so as we think about this data collection, it is a theological issue because all of these things can reorient us away from Jesus and towards something else.

Sam Rohrer:

And we’re not even getting into it right now, but content process, all of those kinds of things. Anyway, so we’ll leave it right there. Let’s move into this other area here now James, that is this the speed of the advancement of technology, AI technology, biometric use technology, the increasingly invasive role, I’m going to put that way of tyrannical and centralized controlled by government and business elites, which is what’s happening now is literally historic in the days of tyrannical governments of the past, they did not have the technology and all that we’re talking about today. Otherwise things would’ve been different then. But now it’s different. So it’s not unsuspected what’s happening since I’m going to say ladies and gentlemen, biblically and prophetically. It’s foretold that these days would come but couched within remarkable deceptive communications that are enhanced and in many cases created and manipulated by developmental ai, the ability of this technology we’re describing to literally create circumstances out of thin air and along with them pre-designed the solutions for problems, be it the problems of nine 11 that were created to, I’m going to say their most recently, the COVID global assault, a major global problem for which there was already a concocted answer.

These things will only increase because of rapid warp speed advancement of AI and technology because it’s all shrouded in deception and mind control. That’s clashing with, as Dr. Spencer said, that which the Holy Spirit gives and guides and directs, and particularly for those whose eyes are open, those of us who are true believers in Jesus Christ who have our identity in Christ. So there’s a clash. I hope you see that that’s the point of that title. But James is someone who follows technology advancement. Let’s take just a few minutes to establish a bit more clearly if we could, the reality of technological implementation, what we’re talking about including the build out of AI data centers, this cabal of billionaire leaders and governments around the world who are consolidating us, what can you share that shows the coordination and the motivation for what is clearly a concerted effort? Could you do that?

James Spencer:

I’ll try. I think I take a more charitable approach to this. So I think most of the individuals involved don’t have a biblical worldview. They don’t really understand what’s wrong with the world. And so they’re looking at the wicked problem, these sort of complex things that have to come together in order for the world to sustain itself. And they’re not factoring in human sin, they’re not factoring in the fear of the Lord. They’re not factoring in any of these theological concepts. And so I think as they’re approaching this, what they’re seeing is, and I love this George Carlin quote that he uses. He says, you don’t need a formal conspiracy when interests converge, I think all these people have an interest in seeing a particular form of progress. They’ve come together and they’ve said, look, this is how we end up saving the world. This is how humanity sustains itself.

This is how we get to a better place. And I think what they’re ending up doing is they’re solving a very complex and difficult problem that really needs God in it with technology. They’re replacing essentially technology with God. And so that is sort of the way I think of the way they’re doing things. They’re very smart people who are moving ahead in ignorance of who God is. And because they’re ignorant of who God is, they’re inserting this technology into the world. What do I think that’s going to end up doing? Obviously it’s going to have downstream negative consequences for everyone because we can’t fix the broken world. It’s not going to be fixed. There’s only going to be a different sort of brokenness on the other side of all the technological innovation. But I think my main point is there is a movement called transhumanism and they want us to overcome our biological weaknesses through technology.

That technology could be through devices like we normally have with our cell phone, artificial intelligence. But we’ve also seen some of this in the enhanced games where it’s sort of performance enhancing drugs that are used. And it’s a very transhumanist idea and there’s a very particular form of progress there that I think we’re going to end up running into increasingly. And that to me is the major problem that we’re facing with some of these AI data centers. It’s what lies behind them. Everybody wants things to get better, but they don’t understand what better is. Everybody wants to have progress, but they don’t understand what progress is leading us. Everybody wants the world to be at a better place, but they can’t define what that is. And I think apart from Christ, they never can. And so that’s how I would sort of explain the motivation that I see from more of a theological perspective. These are really smart people moving ahead in ignorance of who God is.

Sam Rohrer:

James, as you said, that is a very charitable approach that I would not deny from my perspective at all. But I would say that for many, I think you probably are right. They want that which is better because they have not embraced a biblical world of view and consider things through the lens of scripture. They by a pragmatic approach say, well, you know what? In light of what I see, this is probably the best way to go. But on the other hand, I’m going to say I believe that there are within the system very strongly demonically led individuals such as many who I could name frankly who have said that this transhumanist approach its purpose is that we have become God and that we can do better and free will be killed. We don’t need free will. We’re going to be able to implant within people’s minds that which will be better based on what they say. So there is that element too. So you may have some thoughts on that, but within that context, certainly where God’s will, God’s way and God’s word has been set aside, the end cannot be good. Any other thoughts?

James Spencer:

No, I think it’s fully fair. I think that’s a good counterpoint to what I said. I think when we look into the book of Revelation, you start to see these sort of empires that are built and their whole modus operandi is to get people worshiping the empire. And that is akin, I think to what we’re talking about when we say abolishing free will, that there is a sense in which that deception is how free will is abolished, that we’ve become so brainwashed into thinking that the empire, the technological infrastructure, the tech geniuses, whatever we look at is the end all be all of human existence. And as we’re looking toward them, we’re missing all that God is doing. And I do think that there are pernicious actors who are doing things that are evil in that way, but ultimately I would say that whether they’re doing it from that evil perspective, like a deliberate move against God or whether they just happen to be opposing God and are just sort of blissfully clueless, that it leads us to the same place. And that is where Christians have to be aware of these patterns. They have to be aware that there is a myth of progress that is driving a lot of what we do in our daily lives and that these things are antithetical to the gospel of Jesus Christ.

Sam Rohrer:

And I think that’s a great summary, and ladies and gentlemen, as you’re listening, I hope that you’re saying, okay, yeah, that certainly makes sense because the scripture gives us God’s way, which he says, you fear me and you keep my commandments. I will bring blessings to you, your family, and to any nation who does that. But if you do not fear me and you decide to go your own way, and then ultimately the counterfeit Christ antichrist will come and present himself as an answer. But for which like he deceived Eve is the exact opposite. So this is what we’re talking about. We’ll come back. We’re going to go a little further into a little bit now how the strategy of deceiving people’s actually working itself out. Again, if you’re just joining us, our theme today, the clash of IDs, individual identifications, IDs, digital versus divine, my special guest, Dr. James Spencer, he’s the president of the Useful to God Ministry.

Why are we talking about this matter of id? Well, because all around us, each of us have already handed over some aspect of our personally identifiable data, which we described and defined a little bit in the first segment. Could be your eyes, could be your face biometrics, could be your fingerprints, it could be your gait, the way you walk. It could be, well, a number of things. As my guest Dr. James Spencer said, he and I are both on the radio. Our voices are actually unique to us as well. So it could be a number of different things, but increasingly our government and the governments of the world are utilizing advanced technology and artificial intelligence to drive decision making and the control of the entire process in which we live, but it hinges on IDs getting us and having us use our faces or our fingerprints or our hands or an embedded chip in our bodies.

This is where it is going all governed by artificial intelligence. It’s being pushed fast right here, including in our own government and our own president. Is this at warp speed? The UK prime Minister last week told the people there that they will all be having to hand their IDs over, and if they don’t operate that way, they’re not going to buy or sell. Of course that sounds very prophetic and it is. Now that being the case, that’s where we’re going because this matter is something we’ve got to consider. Now, according to scripture, the time in which we live being the latter years of the end of days, we’ve talked about this before. Jesus said would be marked by all of the signs that he gave his disciples in Matthew 24, starting with deception that he talked about wars, rumors of wars, pestilence, earthquakes, volcanic eruptions, that kind of thing.

The ground is actually groaning and then increasing persecution, it says of God’s people. That’s both Jews and Christians. That’s why you’re seeing all of that rise as well. Now these signs, of course will increase as scripture says, leading to an actual birth. And Jesus says birth pangs, that’s what he says. They’re birth pangs. Ultimately those birth pangs of which I think right now we’re witnessing Braxton Hicks, they are increasing though we can see them frequency and intensity, but ultimately when it begins, there will be a birth. What is that birth? Well, that birth is actually the beginning of the tribulation period. And that delivery of that birth is soon at hand by all evidences. Now, Dr. James Spencer, the first response Jesus gave to his disciples about these times was Don’t be deceived. And he also said, when you see these things don’t be perplexed because they have to happen now not being the case.

It’s hard for us in America to believe as an example that there are things about which we see and hear that are not true. Yet we saw on grand display during the many months and the years of COVID how so much of what we saw and heard was absolutely not true. We’re now seeing it every day in all kinds of way on social media because AI is totally generating people comments and the whole thing. And it’s actually becoming a problem where generally in court system, when there’s testimony provided, if they provide video footage as an example, it’s kind of like you can’t deny that. Well, now it is a problem because it’s being generated and it’s so real, they can’t tell. So we’re getting ourselves into a real fix, but deception is all around us. Now, when you and I were talking, you used a phrase that I want you to build out on, and that was the cult of human progress. I’d like for you to expand upon that as how that may be behind this broader picture of why we’re having so much deception thrust upon us and so many people believing it.

James Spencer:

Yeah. So when I refer to the cult human progress, it really is tied into this idea we can overcome our biological or our human limitations, and we can do that through technological means. The simple way to say it is we can solve human problems with human solutions. Now, theologically, we know that that’s just not the case. We don’t work ourselves out of the situation that we’re in. We’re in a situation, a state of sin, we’re fallen. We can’t effort our way out of that. There has to be some sort of a divine intervention that comes in and actually saves us from ourselves. And so the technological aspects of this that I find problematic in the regressive aspects that I find problematic are just this, that we somehow think that if we just keep trying things, things will actually get better. And what ends up happening is that enough of those things are actually pretty good for society.

I’m all happy when I pull up a Word document and I don’t have to type. They’re typing in high school and I had a lot of whiteout on that typing page word processor, much easier to use, highly convenient. That’s a nice little piece of progress. So we can point to things like that. We can point to the convenience of cell phones, we can point to safety features on cars. We can point to all these different things and we can say, look, the world is getting better through technology, but then we really look at what we’re losing and we don’t look at the negative consequences of that technology. It’s as if the progress, the project progress asks us to put on rose colored glasses and say, oh no, there’s no real problem with fake AI. There’s no real problem with the proliferation of internet pornography. There’s no real problem with the social bullying that goes on social media.

These are minor concerns, and we’ll weed those out as we go. This is sort of that cult of progress that I’m talking about. It’s a progressively slow boiling us in the pot sort of situation that we’re in where we now have no real understanding of where we can draw a line, put our foot down and say, this is all the progress I’ve ever wanted. This is all we really need. And going any further than that, we are giving up aspects of our humanness that we don’t want to give up, but we’re not thinking clearly about that because we haven’t really rooted ourselves in a theological anthropology, a theological sense of what it means to be human. And so as we have these new technologies available to us, we’re just adopting them as if they have no impact on us. But I would just, I’ll close this off and say Marshall McCluen, who is a media theorist, he talks about media as an extension of man that’s often been applied to technology that these technologies extend us. And so in just the same way that you might pick up a fork at dinner so you don’t have to use your fingers, it’s an extension of your hand, that’s a great thing. But what we have to understand is that technology also extends the worst part of us. It extends our best parts and it extends our worst parts.

Speaker 3:

And

James Spencer:

I think we’re not dealing enough with what we’re extending that worst part of us that we’re extending, we’re not even thinking through it. We’re barely touching it with policy. We’re barely touching it with slowdowns on tech development. We are just running headlong into the worst aspects of humanity and hoping that the good will went out. And I think that’s a real fallacy.

Sam Rohrer:

I think you’ve raised a great, really great point on that. It reminds me very much where we are, where things are moving so quickly, there’s a global attitude around all of this. And on this matter of technology and ai, it’s now come to the point where the governments of the world are saying, even in our own country, if we don’t get there first with this, some other nation like China as an example, is going to surpass us. They’re already way ahead of us, frankly. So now we’re all rushing into an area that even a few congressmen that have some wisdom saying, wait a minute, we don’t even have any restrictions on this. This is like the old West Days where there’s no law governing it. And that’s exactly what you’re saying. There’s no restraint on any of what’s being done, and it’s strictly whatever can be done will be done without any consideration of God or anything else. And therein is the problem that you’re talking about, right?

James Spencer:

Yeah, because I can sit back and say, and I do believe this, I think there are good use cases for artificial intelligence. They’re usually pretty narrow, they’re pretty closed off, they’re highly controlled, but they really can be helpful. But that’s not to say that the whole thing is right. And what I’m talking about is those are good within a set of restraints, they’re constrained uses of artificial intelligence that I think could be really fantastic and can be really helpful. But it is. It’s this unrestrained environment that we’re walking into that is in some ways being thrust upon us. That is really, really problematic because it speaks to, it’s an instantiation, a manifestation of an underlying philosophy that is antithetical to the gospel. It’s one that says, humans can fix the world, and if we just keep moving down this path, moving down this path, doing what we’re doing, continuing to put out new technology, continuing to exercise more control, collect more data, what have you, all of those different,

Sam Rohrer:

And James, I don’t know if I just lost you or not,

James Spencer:

Is what Jesus is for. And so I would even argue, we talked in the last segment about these pernicious actors who are really seeing us becoming like God, but I would say implicit within the overall philosophy is that notion that we can become like God. I mean this is no different than the choice you’ve made in the garden. She’s looking around and saying, yeah, this is nice, but what if there’s something better? And she decides to ignore God’s terms and live on her own. And I think that’s what we’re doing over and over and over again, the underlying philosophy of these technologies to do that over and over and over again. And we just need to return a bit and ask ourselves, what does it really mean to live independent independence on God as opposed to independent from him?

Sam Rohrer:

James, that brings us to the real question. And ladies and gentlemen, stay with us. We’ll come back just because of the limitations of time on this program, we’re not going to be able to completely answer that question. But when we can see those of us who know the truth, the truth of God’s word, and we know as we see the things around us that are leading us to the God of this world, alright, where do we draw the line and say no? Where do we say, okay, we will try to give a little bit of clarity to that answer because that’s really where wisdom is so greatly needed for all of those who fear God. Well, as we go into our final segment, I just want to thank all of you for being with us today. And a reminder that this program, our Stand in the Gap weekend program, the minute program, our TV program, and so much more is available not just on our website, which we’ll hear again on the end of the program, stand in the gap radio.com, but also on our app.

I was just at an event in Virginia over the weekend and was talking with a number of individuals there, and I just showed them. I said, Hey, you ought to download our app and it’s very easy. And they brought it out and I just walked them through with it. And as they looked through it, a number of these educators, they were at that meeting, biblical educators said, wow, wow, I didn’t know that There’s a lot of information here. And I said, yes, indeed, there is. And that’s the point. There is a wealth of information because you can go to on the app or on the website, and you can sort can look for a topic, you can look for programs that have guests that are recurring on the program, and then it’s very easy to look at it. The transcripts are available there, you can read them, and then very easy to pass it along to a friend.

In these days when we’re bombarded by deception on all hands, what a great thing to be able to communicate truth. And that’s what I want to encourage you to do. With that in mind, I’ll just pass that along and ask you to pray for us. Wisdom is very, very important. We need wisdom here. We’d pray for that regularly. We need you to pray for us. We need you to consider sharing with us financially because this costs money. And unfortunately, we all know you need money to live. We need funds in order to make this program possible. So with that in mind, I’m going to go on as we try to wrap up the program today. Again, our theme is this, the Clash of IDs, digital versus Divine. Alright, now, James, let’s go back into this because in this conversation today, we’ve identified a very real problem describing where we talked about the what of the digital id, ai, artificial intelligence, technology, how these are all being woven together.

It’s frankly woven within. I’m going to say this world system, which the scripture tells us, this world system is led by the prince and power of the air, the demonic deception. Jesus said, deception and all deception is demonic. Jesus also said that from the day that he was here to the time which we’re live now, the spirit of antichrist would be at work and it would increase. And I think we’re seeing that clearly increase, but for as long as true believers are here following Christ, living holy, we must be aware of the tactics of the devil, the fact that a counterfeit Christ is coming soon to be revealed, but we have to be prepared that we don’t get caught up in the system and cross that line where we end up disobeying God himself in his command. So in practical terms, it’s like know how you’d approach this as Bible believers who say, my identity is in Christ. I know I have an identity here that the world wants and put it in a digital form, but it’s what they want me to do with it. That’s even more critical. Where do I draw the line? Where do I say, wait a minute too far? Just put some thoughts together on that because people I think are wanting to know what to do and they’re not getting much instruction on what to do.

James Spencer:

Yeah. So I think in all the research I’ve done, one of the things I would just encourage people most is don’t try to reform back to an identity in Christ. Start with an identity in Christ. So in other words, let’s not start with our current state of life and say, what should I get rid of in order to be more of a Christian? How do I follow Jesus? Well, I think that’s probably the wrong approach. I think what we need to do is we need to dig into scripture. We need to understand theology. We need to get a sense of who we are as human beings, how we relate to God, and we need to begin constructively working that out. That’s just sort of a general statement because once we get into the practicalities of life, I would tell you it’s extremely difficult to unwind a lot of these things.

Now, all of us could probably get off social media that wouldn’t, I grew up without social media. I promise you it’s possible. So we could get off social media and nobody, no Christian would ever be in a detrimental spot because they’re not on social media. We could decide what we’re going to listen to and when we’re going to listen to it. If you think about the intensity with which the news comes at us today, there’s a massive difference between getting that on the internet on a daily basis or getting into your email on a daily basis, getting a text about it than there is about waiting for a newspaper to come out once a week. And so part of it is that we are participating in these ecosystems that don’t really need to, we don’t need to have Amazon deliver to us in one day.

Most of the time, we can actually take our time and figure out what we want, why we want it, if it’s really relevant to us. And so I think there are a whole host of practices that involve us slowing down, not being caught up in the current of the technological progress, but that will still allow us to participate in the world through things like email and text and use of an iPhone. I mean, I don’t know that we have clean lines around any of this stuff, but what I would just say is we’ve got to start by thinking through what tendencies are these technologies ingraining within me? How are they separating me from other human beings and how are they screening, creating a screen between me and God? And as we answer those questions and reflect on them, I think each of us personally is going to come up with much stronger ideas of how this looks on the privacy issues.

My tendency is to think that part of it, sadly, is just going to be a little bit inevitable. I think we’re going to have a real hard time given where we are right now and given the information we’ve already given out on the internet, that we aren’t in a position where those things are just sort of the horses left the barn. But I would say we still need to be cautious about continuing to put our information out there. We can stop. We can’t probably pull back what’s already been released, but we can stop allowing these companies to collect our information in other ways. We can take the more inconvenient routes. We don’t have to have single sign-ons for everything. We don’t have to use Google to sign into these various other websites and apps. There are just ways for us to protect ourselves a little bit better.

And so my encouragement would be, number one, dig into scripture, understand what we are as human beings, understand what it means to live dependent on God as opposed to independent to him, and then start educating yourself about the various technologies you’re actually using. My guess is that a lot of people just don’t understand fully what the ramifications of hitting. I agree to the terms, terms and conditions are on every website they visit, allowing cookies, those kind of things. We just need to educate ourselves and really deeply understand what it is that we’re doing on a daily basis so we can make intelligent choices about it.

Sam Rohrer:

Dr. James Spencer, I think that was really very, very good, and I’m glad you did that, ladies and gentlemen, because if you are a true believer where your identity is in Christ, we know that we can’t avoid the temptations of this world without the help of the Holy Spirit. We know that we have to be fed daily by God’s word. We have to be walking in a spirit of humility and fear before God and reverence for him and praying daily for wisdom and discernment. Call these things we’re talking about. We have to have discernment and prayer, and how do we get that by walking with the Lord? So all of that makes sense. Dr. James Spencer, thank you so very, very much for being with me today, your website, ladies and Gentlemen, his website, Dr. James Spencer, is@usefultogod.com, useful to god.com. Thanks again. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for being with us again on this Monday program as we begin this week. Stay with us and be with us every day of the week. It’ll be a full week. A lot will be coming this way, the Lord willing, and to the extent that you are able stand in the gap for truth. Don’t bow the knee. Obey the Lord inferior.